My Internet: Yi-Ling Liu
The author’s new book is hotly anticipated by Grimes.
Embedded is your essential guide to what’s good on the internet, written by Kate Lindsay and edited by Nick Catucci.
Every other week we quiz a “very online” person for their essential guide to what’s good on the internet.
Today we welcome Yi-Ling Liu, a writer and editor whose book, The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet, is out this week on Knopf. Yi-Ling quit Snapchat after a high-schooler’s obsession with a streak spooked her out and went viral for writing about “involution,” or being trapped in an endless cycle of meaningless competition. —Nick
EMBEDDED: Do you tweet? Why?
YI-LING LIU: I once tweeted regularly but no longer do. The people I wanted to engage and hang out with stopped tweeting, so now I hang out with them elsewhere.
EMBEDDED: What do you use Instagram for?
YI-LING LIU: I use it every few months or so to share, promote and engage with the work of other writers and artists that I admire. Otherwise, trying to wean myself off it completely.
EMBEDDED: What do you like about TikTok? What do you dislike?
YI-LING LIU: I like that it’s created all kinds of unexpected cultural collisions. I dislike that it’s insanely addictive.
EMBEDDED: Were you concerned by TikTok remaining under Chinese control? Are you concerned about it coming under the control of President Trump’s allies?
YI-LING LIU: I am more concerned of the lack of US oversight and regulations on social media companies in general, TikTok being one of many.
EMBEDDED: Where do you tend to get your news?
YI-LING LIU: Newspapers (i.e. The New York Times, the FT, The Guardian,) tech-focused outlets (i.e. WIRED, MIT Tech Review, Rest of World,) and lots of different Substack newsletters.
EMBEDDED: How do you keep up with the online discourse? How important is it to you to do this?
YI-LING LIU: I try my best to keep up with Chinese online discourse, which I think is a huge blind spot to people living outside of China. I’m on Chinese social media platforms, like Xiaohongshu, Weibo and Zhihu and I also read the work of people who are astute observers of the Chinese web.
EMBEDDED: What’s a popular misconception that you see repeated online?
YI-LING LIU: That China is a monolith.
EMBEDDED: What are your favorite newsletters?
YI-LING LIU: I’ve been really enjoying WIRED’s “Made in China” newsletter, and the Transformer newsletter to understand the latest AI policy news. Also love The Pleasure Lists and Supernuclear.
EMBEDDED: Do you believe that the “artificial general intelligence” and “superintelligence” that many AI boosters have warned of actually pose a risk to humanity?
YI-LING LIU: I don’t trust the boosters who are using the rhetoric of AGI to hype up their products; I do take very seriously the scientists and technologists who are warning about potentially catastrophic risks from increasingly advanced AI—the concentration of power in the hands of small elite, unprecedented economic disruption.
EMBEDDED: Are smartphones bad for us? Where do you fall on the Jonathan Haidt-Taylor Lorenz divide?
YI-LING LIU: Mostly bad, because of the social media apps. They are designed to extract my attention for profit, not boost my wellbeing.
EMBEDDED: Do you try to limit your phone use? If so, what methods have been helpful for this?
YI-LING LIU: Quite aggressively. I block many apps through the Freedom app throughout the day and night, and recently bought a Brick, which I like.
EMBEDDED: How do you find recommendations for what to watch, read, and listen to?
YI-LING LIU: I ask my friends irl.
EMBEDDED: Have you had posts go viral? What is that experience like?
YI-LING LIU: I tweeted an article that I wrote for The New Yorker on the Chinese slang word “involution”—which is essentially the experience of being trapped in an endless cycle of meaningless competition. I think the sentiment resonated with people from all around the world, who were saying things like “I’m involuted too.”
EMBEDDED: Who’s the coolest person who follows you?
YI-LING LIU: She doesn’t follow me yet, but apparently Grimes commented on X that she thought my book looked interesting…
EMBEDDED: Have you ever been heavily into Snapchat? Do you miss it?
YI-LING LIU: In college for a brief period. Then I met a high schooler during a summer camp where I was a counsellor who told us he emailed Snapchat to revive a lost snapstreak that he kept up with a girl he liked for more than a hundred days. That spooked me. I got rid of it and haven’t missed it since.
EMBEDDED: Do any of your group chats have a name that you’re willing to share? What’s something that recently inspired debate in the chat?
YI-LING LIU: Chaoyang Trap, a group chat of Beijing-based friends which became a newsletter. It’s discontinued, but the Chaoyang spirit lives on.
EMBEDDED: What’s your go-to emoji, and what does it mean to you?
YI-LING LIU: 🥰 Beaming with love and warmth for you
EMBEDDED: Do you text people voice notes? If not, how do you feel about getting them?
YI-LING LIU: Yes, though way more frequently on WeChat than any other platform. Voice notes are so much more ubiquitous in China and way easier to do on the WeChat user interface, which cuts off at 60 seconds to prevent people from rambling endlessly.
EMBEDDED: What’s your favorite non-social media app?
YI-LING LIU: Insight Timer, my meditation apps. I use it the most according to my phone screentime records. Also the Catan Universe app.
EMBEDDED: Do you regularly use eBay, Depop, or other shopping platforms? What’s a recent thing you’ve bought or sold?
YI-LING LIU: Taobao! (Where you can truly find everything.) I bought a mushroom-shaped lamp from a bar in Shanghai that my friend really liked to give her one day.
EMBEDDED: Have you recently read an article, book, or social media post about the internet that you’ve found particularly insightful?
YI-LING LIU: I thought Harper’s piece on gooning was shocking, depressing and insightful. Even non-gooners can understand the experience of being helplessly sucked into an online spiral.
EMBEDDED: What’s the last thing that brought you joy online?
YI-LING LIU: Receiving birthday messages from loved ones around the world
Thanks Yi-Ling! Buy her book.
More My Internet Kaitlin Phillips ∙ Emma Specter ∙ Liz Franczak ∙ Anthony Fantano ∙ Alison Roman ∙ All
I got my copy in the mail yesterday and have never been more excited